Fast, photo-realistic maps

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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby GiJoe » Wed Sep 20, 2006 2:24 pm

Couldnt you overlay a grid
on top of the original grayscale
graphic and use individual
squares from that grid to generate
smaller map pieces ?
So instead of one big model you would
have smaller map sections that
fit together to form a larger model.
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby TTorpedo » Wed Sep 20, 2006 3:05 pm

Yeah thats a way around it
but the idea was cut down work by making more than one map at once... (i´always thinking on ways to cut down work :D )
On the other hand since the texture is applyed "randomly" by the computer the individual squares would never perfectly match.
But yes that tecnic could be done for lets say a "4 map region"
Maybe whith the new CC3 re-realease on the horizon i will have a go at a summer/ winter operation

So i will ask again Anyone whith good "russian" topographic batle site maps?
The Iwo Jima one add curves every 6 meters, a smaller area would be even better

ps: Gijoe I can send you the grey scale image of Iwo Jima if you want to plant some coconut trees!
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby JimRM2 » Wed Sep 20, 2006 7:30 pm

Took the words out of my mouth. I was going to suggest altering the focal points too I just wasn't sure if that was possible. In the past the 3D progs I've worked with had a fixed perspective although I seem to recall the camera settings you mentioned. Had no idea that's how you altered the "distance" of the focal points. Actually the focal points remain fixed you're just changing the way in which you're viewing them right? Since focal points represent a point of theoretically infinite distance.

GiJoe any other obstacles you can think of with regard to drawing a map in 3D to get a 2D view? Things that add to the time it takes? I might have to find this program somewhere if not and start learning how to use it. As a community we could share object libraries we create much in the same way we share textures.
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby GiJoe » Thu Sep 21, 2006 1:50 am

I could add that any trees you made in 3d have to be hidden
before doing the final overhead screenshots since cc uses
its own tree graphics....leaving any 3d trees visible would just conflict.

There are 2 final overhead screenshots. One to capture
the roofs (with trees off) and then another to capture
the interiors (trees, roofs and walls off to expose the interior floors)
This assumes you initially made your
buildings as three seperate objects grouped together
(roofs walls floors)to facilitate getting the final interior screenshot


Then you add in normal 2d cc tree trunks/shadows and building level numbers.
via your normal 2d graphic program
and should finally be ready to start coding.
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby TTorpedo » Thu Sep 21, 2006 11:07 am

Its a pitty not to be able to use the vue trees.

I think its faster to add the tree trunk/ shadow and bulding interiors on a 2d paint program. Keeping the 3d model lighter

Althought not using the trees and buildings on 3d eliminates one of the main advantages of the all 3d thing, that is casting the shadows acuratley.
Besides you can´t take 3d views of the map hadding a soldier level view or a aerial recon view (don´t know here to fit it on the game anyway)
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby JimRM2 » Thu Sep 21, 2006 4:50 pm

There probably isn't any way that you can tell a 3D program to only cast shadows of certain objects while keeping those objects invisible can you? I suppose there's probably no practical reason why that feature would be needed in a 3D prog outside of the one we're discussing here. As TTorpedo said bummer you can't make use of that advantage a 3D prog gives.
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby TTorpedo » Thu Sep 21, 2006 5:20 pm

last minute correction, just find out that Its possible to tell an object just do cast shadows
Just tryed with Vue trees ( i guess this feature is avaible in other programs as well)

In Vue is also possible to leave the trunks and just take the leafs. But the branches are atached to the trunks....
for buildings i guess it might work providing the roof its independent...
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby JimRM2 » Thu Sep 21, 2006 10:51 pm

Wow I may have to get Vue and give this a try. Sounds promising. So you could even do accurate interiors with proper shadows as well. I'm trying to think if there might be some other kind of show stopper that would prevent someone from using this tool to make maps. Frankly I don't think it would matter since the issue of doing shadows and elevation shading alone would be reason enough to use it.

Something else that would improve the look of the maps would be the scale at which you can draw the 3D model. Textures would look more real because you can make them larger than CC scale so that when they're scaled down to CC scale they look more crisp and real.

Very cool.
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby Senior Drill » Fri Sep 22, 2006 2:22 am

Go easy on the scope of the details, Jim. Piles of steaming dog crap on the sidewalks would be going a bit too far to achieve realism unless the coding can be done to make a soldier not want to go prone or crawl through that element tile. :D
C'est magnifique, mais ce n'est pas la guerre. - Pierre Bosquet, 1854
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby Von_B » Fri Sep 22, 2006 3:03 am

A 'Red Light District' element could have a profound effect on troops morale?
Image
[font=Arial]SILENCE! when you speak to an Officer![size=17]
Fourty Two
http://www.thewizard.org
[/size][/font]
[font=Verdana]What goes around, comes around....[/font]
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby yukongold » Fri Sep 22, 2006 5:42 am

So would Hugh Hefner's mansion in the middle of the battle zone........ :) You would only need one victory location.......the pool. Every man for himself.....
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby JimRM2 » Fri Sep 22, 2006 4:50 pm

Senior Drill wrote:Go easy on the scope of the details, Jim. Piles of steaming dog crap on the sidewalks would be going a bit too far to achieve realism unless the coding can be done to make a soldier not want to go prone or crawl through that element tile. :D


LMAO Watch out for those "land mines". :D

No seriously tho, I should've been more specific and over explain as written communication so often demands. By detail I mean the stuff that is pertinent to CC such as anything that blocks LOS or movement. As it stands right now the CC world is far cleaner than reality could ever hope to be. I'm guessing the current CC world is so clean it would make Martha Stewart proud. I mean really where's the garbage? The piles of crap scattered everywhere. No I don't mean animal or human crap. :D I mean the crates, boxes barrels, dead cars, heaps of refuse from the loss of sanitation services, piles of firewood, dead trees, lumber, pipes, and on and on. In the case of the Jethro mod it could've benefitted from the smattering of washing machines, old heavy duty wire spools (the 6'diameter variety) etc. If all of this stuff was created as a 3D library it requires a single click to enter it into the map. The shadows automatically created.

Also meant by the word "detail" is the kind of detail that is visible at CC scale that doesn't currently appear in CC textures that would be difficult as hell to draw by hand. Roof textures rarely show roofing tiles, rocks, boulders, fallen trees, grass, etc. I wouldn't take the time to draw them in 2D but if they were drawn in 3D they'd look proper and real and shadows would be auto generated.

I could go on but I'll spare you guys the boredom.

This is my personal goal as an artist and what I want to see in my art... I'm sticking to it. ;) I guess we'll see if anyone finds it an improvement once I've had the chance (if I do) to create maps this way. Regardless it's the world I intend to create in my art. Previously the tools available to do this (at least to myself) don't reasonably allow this concept to be created within the limits of r/l demands on time and everything else. It's an opportunity for me to achieve a vision.

To remain on topic, my feeling is that the real photos simply aren't appealing to look at. They're blurry and lack the kind of crispness I'd like to see in CC maps. They have dull color usually and don't hold a family of form that the rest of the game does. As I've said before it's just my opinion and one I intend to stick to. IF I was a consumer it would not be what I would spend my money on.
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Re: Fast, photo-realistic maps

Postby CSO_Talorgan » Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:54 pm

Is the "Easel" version of Vue 6 up to the job?
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